Author Topic: Celebrate Chelsea's Freedom!  (Read 2121 times)

Offline smiling

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Celebrate Chelsea's Freedom!
« on: May 08, 2017, 11:45:13 PM »
Chelsea Manning is going to be free! Celebrate with us!
On International Day Against Homophobia, Transphobia and Biphobia, Chelsea will come out of prison after seven years.
Her 35-year sentence was commuted by Obama. It was a victory for Chelsea of course, but also for all of us in many countries who supported her and benefited from her courageous whistleblowing: the international women and lgbtq movements, the anti-war and anti-racist movements, the movements of whistleblowers, war veterans, refuseniks and everyone who stands for justice.

On 17 May, we celebrate Chelsea’s freedom in many cities:
· In London Payday and Queer Strike will have a celebration vigil on the steps of St Martin-in-the-Fields (Trafalgar Sq. WC2 N 4JJ) from 5.30 – 7 pm.
. And Peace News is having a party at Housmans bookshop from 7pm.
· So far events that we know of are also planned in Boston, Philadelphia and San Francisco. Details to be confirmed soon.

https://www.facebook.com/events/199229923928425/
..auch die Ruhe nach dem Sturm
is nur die Ruhe vor dem Sturm.
(Georg Danzer)

Offline Betty Croker's frosted buns

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Re: Celebrate Chelsea's Freedom!
« Reply #1 on: May 17, 2017, 05:12:13 PM »
I'm not really sure how womens movements or LGBTQ movements or anti-racist movements benefitted from the actions of Chelsea Manning. Maybe you could explain more, Smiling? I'd like to know the basis for that.

Given the way that disclosures from whistleblowers were used to ensure a Trump victory and the power of Isis and the dark web, I'm also not sure her actions in disclosing more than 700,000 confidential military and diplomatic documents to WikiLeaks, when she would have no control over how they were used, by whom and for what purpose was in any way striking a progressive blow against the bad guys.

I may be wrong and I am happy to listen to information to the contrary but the most favourable description I can think of for her is "dangerously naieve."

Offline smiling

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Re: Celebrate Chelsea's Freedom!
« Reply #2 on: May 17, 2017, 09:54:29 PM »
there is A LOT about her online - you could find info and learn.
a good page to look at is this one: http://www.refusingtokill.net/Chelsea%20Manning/usabradleymanningindex.htm
..auch die Ruhe nach dem Sturm
is nur die Ruhe vor dem Sturm.
(Georg Danzer)

Offline Betty Croker's frosted buns

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Re: Celebrate Chelsea's Freedom!
« Reply #3 on: May 17, 2017, 10:15:28 PM »
there is A LOT about her online - you could find info and learn.
a good page to look at is this one: http://www.refusingtokill.net/Chelsea%20Manning/usabradleymanningindex.htm

Sorry but there's a lot on there about whether the Queer community were adequately supporting Chelsea Manning.

But I couldn't see anything there that relates to how her actions supported the LGBTQ community, womens organisations or anti-racist movements.

Offline Grey

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Re: Celebrate Chelsea's Freedom!
« Reply #4 on: May 18, 2017, 01:58:32 AM »
It's been amazing to hear Chelsea's finally out!!
Hope you had a good turn out-I had to work but kept cheering everytime she was on the news

Offline scouser

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Re: Celebrate Chelsea's Freedom!
« Reply #5 on: May 18, 2017, 11:59:37 PM »
She / was very brave I think! :)
One day I'll laugh about this!😑

Offline Betty Croker's frosted buns

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Re: Celebrate Chelsea's Freedom!
« Reply #6 on: May 19, 2017, 09:42:33 AM »
I wouldn't argue that she wasn't, Scouser. But the road to hell is paved with good intentions and misplaced courage. There are probably those who think strapping explosives to your body and turning yourself into a human bomb is courageous and the info she disclosed could quite easily have ended up in the hands of people like that. Or helped Trump steal the presidency or inspired those who did inadvertently help that happen.

I am a loss when my colleagues say to me "Why do the LGBT community consider Chelsea Manning a hero?" I can see that see played a role in the anti-war movement but on balance did a lot of potential harm too. But I haven't been able to find anything that supports the claim that the LGBTQ Movement, women's movements and anti-racist movements benefitted from what she did. That's why I was asking what the basis of that claim was.

« Last Edit: May 19, 2017, 10:26:21 AM by Betty Croker's frosted buns »

Offline Grey

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Re: Celebrate Chelsea's Freedom!
« Reply #7 on: May 19, 2017, 03:42:01 PM »
She / was very brave I think! :)

Unbelievably brave
And did you see her first photos?

Offline scouser

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Re: Celebrate Chelsea's Freedom!
« Reply #8 on: May 19, 2017, 11:52:37 PM »
No.
One day I'll laugh about this!😑

Offline the ganze metsieh

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Re: Celebrate Chelsea's Freedom!
« Reply #9 on: May 20, 2017, 12:09:52 AM »
^^I did. I don't know anything about a tradition of granting clemency by outgoing presidents but the fact that Obama commuted her sentence seemed to underline the stark contrast between his presidency and what we all dreaded would be Trump's, and that he did it presumably while also doing all the other larger things like hastily preserving climate change data. I found that pretty amazing and a good enough vote of confidence.

Offline Betty Croker's frosted buns

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Re: Celebrate Chelsea's Freedom!
« Reply #10 on: May 20, 2017, 11:59:57 AM »
Would he have done it if he knew what was to come though with the sabatoge of Hilary's chance for the presidency? I know he has since tried to justify his decision but he is hardly going to come out and say, "Whoops, dropped a bollock there." But the main distinction is he thought the injustice was the length of sentence - it was a sentence for traitors and profiteers not unstable and naieve wannabe do-gooders. He said justice was done by the length of the sentence served already. Which was not an approval of her actions or endorsement of her as a hero.

I think many are quite rightly doubting whether whistle blowing and selective disclosures in the current climate is the progressive move it was claimed. I feel the same about Assange.

I don't have a problem with her sentence being commuted as such.

I can obviously see why the anti-war movement want to portray her as a hero - and I think they are wrong. Bravery isn't enough when you consider the potential damage she may have caused. But I am still wondering why she is being hailed for her contribution to those other movements? Perhaps that was just hyperbole? And if so it makes worse the credibility gap that the left has somehow to overcome if it is to attract the ordinary people that were once it's driving force.

« Last Edit: May 20, 2017, 01:26:24 PM by Betty Croker's frosted buns »