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Let's Talk About... => The Vault => Topic started by: toniee on Mar 21, 2015, 05:37:57 PM

Title: Painful sex?
Post by: toniee on Mar 21, 2015, 05:37:57 PM
I'm putting this out to the experienced women out there, of whatever sexualities. Just read a blog which has pricked my curiosity and I wish to share this to see what others think on this topic.

To begin with I must specify that I am not greatly experienced in sexual practices, so really have very little knowledge on this. What the blogger 'revealed' was that a lot of women have 'painful sex' and that that is part of the deal. It's accepted as being part of sexual contact, which is how I have always viewed things.

According to this female blogger, it is  definitely possible to have painless sex and, as someone with very little experience, I find this difficult to believe as, when I experimented when young, that was my experience. Pain. Logic tells me that, if two things, whatever they may be, are rubbing together, they are naturally going to cause friction. Surely? So I am wondering whether this blogger is creating a bit of fiction and myths about the actual reality of sex? Can anyone enlighten me on this subject??? A bit puzzled by these comments. Where are the sexperts..
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: fetishkitty on Mar 21, 2015, 05:53:52 PM
This might be better in the Vault section, as it would allow people to be a bit more frank, but I wanted to say that yes, absolutely, sex can be a totally pain free experience.

For one thing, there is a LOT more to sex than vaginal penetration (which is what I assume you mean by sex, from some of the things you have said). Lesbian sexuality especially encompasses a whole range of activities that need never be 'painful'.

If you do want to experience penetration without pain then as a lesbian you have hit the jackpot! We are not limited to using what biology gave us...we can change the size and shape of what we use to provide penetration...that's even if we forget that we have fingers and hands...

Finally, your point about friction: this is why God invented lube. Experiment with what works for you. Some people prefer water-based, some silicone-based. Most brands offer trial sizes so you can try before you buy. Check out www.lovehoney.co.uk for a good selection.

Honestly, sex only has to be painful if you want it to be (and yes, some people do). I will also say that I found it very painful the first few times, but that with experience that stopped.

Good luck, and really, don't settle for painful sex. You really don't have to.

kitty
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Blythe on Mar 21, 2015, 06:30:10 PM
Hello Toniee,

Fetish Kitty covered everything I was going to say in reply to your post.

I'm sure every woman has experienced painful sex, especially when we were younger and less experienced.  I remember the first couple of times I had penetration sex, I thought afterwards that it was really disappointing and upsetting as it hurt so much.   
However after copious amounts of practice, I solved the pain problem.  It wasn't lube that was my problem, it was men.

Most of the pain does come from lack of lubrication, whoever you are having sex with.
Most women have to get really excited before they produce loads of their own so lots of people use lube.  They really do. 

I recommend that you get some and have a go with it by yourself. 

In a tiny amount of cases, women have vaginas that may be shallow.  I knew a woman that did and so she had to adjust the size of the items she used, whatever the problem, there is a resolution.

Happy practising!

Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: flora poste on Mar 21, 2015, 06:35:58 PM
Oh goodness yes, the only pain in my s3x life is the pain I want to feel. There is no way I'd accept sex that I did not enjoy or that hurt me - that's not what it's about. I also don't believe just lying back and thinking of England is very respectful to one's s3x partner. Enthusiasm or nothing, as far as I'm concerned.

I remember the first few times I was penetrated vaginally (I hope all these words are sfw?) were extremely painful but that didn't last long. But if s3x hurts you I don't advise you ignore it - your body is sending a clear message. You might get really hurt, if not physically then psychologically. Stop, and maybe try something different.

I think also that you are overlooking arousal and desire, which has many physiological effects - one of which might be an increase in the natural lubrication, sensitivity, and, hmm, stretchiness, of your v@gina. If you're turned on and you are being touched by somebody you are attracted to, it's far more likely to feel good; you may also find that you are suddenly keen to do things that might not have appealed to you in the cold light of day.

What was this blog? I'm curious to know what the context was.

And good luck. There are lots of ways to have a delightful erotic life.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Musette on Mar 21, 2015, 09:43:19 PM
Pretty much what the other have said.

Sex should not hurt unless you want it to.

I reckon the main causes of painful penetrative sex are lack of lubrication (your own or artificially provided, either is just as good); tension (if those vaginal muscles are tense it's going to be really hard work to get anything in there); and, rarely, some other physical cause.

Experiment on yourself and find out what works for you.
Get your partner (if you have one) to take things really slowly and use lots of lube.
Relax relax relax (even if this means consciously relaxing the muscles - you might need to practise contracting and relaxing them).

Also, remember that sex doesn't have to include penetration.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: toniee on Mar 22, 2015, 12:43:43 AM
Thanks for your replies. Actually as a lesbian who had a choice in my own sexual experience when young, (so many women of whatever sexuality having had to endure sexual violence wheny young) I've never actually had nor wanted penetrative sex with a man(or woman), so that was part of the curiosity I had to that article. I'm a bit of a technophobe, so don't know how to upload the article onto this site, but it can be found on Eveydayfeminism.com if anyone would care to upload that. It's called - 'Why don't we talk about painful sex?'.

The thing is, I did experiment for a while with fiorepkay, with a partner when young, and confess that I DID find this painful, stimulation of the clitirus(spelling?). As I think I recall from that article, each time afterwards, it was very difficult to walk properly without feeling discomfort, as I did during foreplay. So I am just wondering if this is one of the things women(and of course gay men) lie about, for whatever reason that might be?

I'm not actually sexually active myself, with others. I've never really been that excited by the physical act.it's emotional excitement and fulfilment that I have mostly sought. So coming across this article, and knowing what I experienced back in my youth, and also having spoken to other women, straight or lesbian, it just got me thinking. Just like the article suggests. Are women actually lying about the truth of sex?
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Groke on Mar 22, 2015, 12:46:43 AM
Sex isn't painful. :-\ I suspect you just weren't turned on enough.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: outoforder on Mar 22, 2015, 12:50:52 AM
There is such a thing as being oversensitive, leasing to pain. It can come and go.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Plus One on Mar 22, 2015, 12:55:44 AM
The only time sex has ever been painful for me was having sex with a man the first time -  I think that is pretty normal.

After that, with women, only when I wasn't turned on enough, or when I wanted it to be.

I don't think 'painful' is a default experience for women either with other women or men... there are physical issues that make it so for some, like vaginismus, but if you are turned on, and lubricated enough, there should not be pain.

The whole genital area is sensitive so if you aren't turned on pretty much anything has the possibility of being painful...  :-\
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: flora poste on Mar 22, 2015, 08:46:28 AM
This is the article: http://everydayfeminism.com/2015/03/lets-talk-about-painful-sex/

I think it makes some really good points. That we compare the sex we are having to the sex we are told we should be having - which can mean a) that we expect a particular experience to hurt as this is the social narrative around it (eg losing penetrative virginity: this is where the 'not being able to walk properly' quote comes from, it's an example of potentially hyperbolic teen-speak, or a young girl trying to own what she has been taught to expect from her first time: pain*) and b) that we will not speak up or seek solutions when sex that is socially portrayed as pleasurable is actually painful for us.

It's not saying that most sex is painful and that all women are lying about it. It's saying that we should be able to speak about and own our authentic experiences, stop worrying about what we are told is good/bad, and pursue our own real pleasure.

Which, toniee, might be a good takeaway message for you.

Sex shouldn't hurt. I'm wondering, based on your most recent post, if you are perhaps just not that into sex? I don't mean that as a negative thing at all: some people just aren't. If you seek an emotional connection above all else, and left to your own devices don't want or need sex, then perhaps you shouldn't force yourself to have it? There are lots of asexual people who have fulfilling relationships without doing anything they don't want/aren't interested in. I'm not going to diagnose you, I've no idea whether you're asexual. But it's worth considering the fact that if you don't fancy sex you don't have to have it.

OTOH, if you do think that something is missing from your life, I'm sure there are loads of resources out there that might help you re-approach sex and discover - perhaps gradually - what works for you.



*nb  - walking like John Wayne after a big night is not necessarily a bad thing...
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: sally33 on Mar 22, 2015, 09:30:59 AM
Toniee - you mention that friction from two things rubbing together during sex is obviously going to cause pain - the solution to this is lube. The expectation that your body will just naturally produce enough lubricant to prevent such friction is a myth. Sometimes, due to various reasons, regardless of how turned on you are, your natural vaginal secretions may not be enough and that will lead to discomfort or pain. Lube (as others have said) will prevent this.

 
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Sorted. on Mar 22, 2015, 09:49:52 AM
Sex can be painful for a lot of reasons. Not all lube/excitement related.

Sex was painful for me for a while.  It was cysts and tumours on the ovaries and a badly positioned ovary causing deep pain.  That was removed and the problem should have been solved.  However, my mind equated sex with pain and so sex was painful. It took a long tine to get over it and penetration is still not my favourite thing. Sometimes, not always, I can be hugely turned on... Until its suggested.

Vaginismus is a very real problem and can have an actual physical cause or something as simple as being told sex would be painful and expecting it and sometimes all the lube in the world - natural or otherwise doesn't help. 
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Plus One on Mar 22, 2015, 10:41:08 AM
Oooo cysts... I had those in my early 20s.... bl000dy painful, I'd forgotten!
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Musette on Mar 22, 2015, 10:45:27 AM
Yes indeed, there is always the possibility of an underlying problem that needs sorting out.

Also, as someone else said, the whole genital area, and the clitoris especially, can be extremely sensitive and even more so when aroused. Sex is not painful for me at all but even so every so often a slight rub the wrong way can make me wince momentarily.

But toniee, just to reiterate, sex shouldn't be painful and if it is then there are steps you can take to try and stop it being painful.
GB is not lying to you :)
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: dukovearl on Mar 22, 2015, 11:51:59 AM
I personally have never really found vigorous or deep penetration at all comfortable, no matter how aroused, so I tell people and they don't do it, the rest is all lovely. I have slept with someone who found direct clitoral stimulation painful, she told me, I didn't do it and the rest was all lovely. We are all different and it's not necessarily a sign that something is wrong, or a lack of arousal/lubrication if we don't like certain things. Self-knowledge and communication are really the keys to better sex, I think.


(Do we need to ask for this to be moved for non-work-safeness?)
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Sorted. on Mar 22, 2015, 11:53:00 AM
^

Aye.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: dukovearl on Mar 22, 2015, 11:57:26 AM
I've never done that - is it *notify*?

RTM? My own post, or what?
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Sorted. on Mar 22, 2015, 12:01:46 PM
I was aye - ing about your comment about the sex

The other thing - I don't know - does the OP have to ask to get it moved?

Don't rtm yourself - you might get a ban and have to be straight for 48 hours.  I've been there.  Dark times.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: dukovearl on Mar 22, 2015, 12:07:31 PM
Oh, right and aye aye, but too late, I have RTM'd but with a comment about the thread, not my part in it and asking for it to be moved please and thank you. If I am banned and straight for 48 hours as a result then I shall facebook you for advice on make-up and ciders to help the time pass more quickly, OK?
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: millicent on Mar 22, 2015, 12:07:41 PM
you might get a ban and have to be straight for 48 hours.  I've been there.  Dark times.

 :o

These bans are harsher than I thought.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Sorted. on Mar 22, 2015, 12:08:45 PM
It was awful.

I even broke a nail. That never happened when I wasn't straight. 

Don't get banned is all!
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: valerie on Mar 22, 2015, 12:47:49 PM
particular section is intended to be "work safe" so please...just sayin
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: dukovearl on Mar 22, 2015, 01:00:57 PM
Yes, valerie, I have RTM'd and asked for the thread to be moved, at the apparent personal risk of being straightened out for 48 hours. Are you at work?
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: dukovearl on Mar 22, 2015, 01:03:00 PM
And thank you Evict for moving it  :D
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: valerie on Mar 22, 2015, 01:11:33 PM
Yes, valerie, I have RTM'd and asked for the thread to be moved, at the apparent personal risk of being straightened out for 48 hours. Are you at work?
not today. It's Sunday.  I am filling in for a pregnant  professor though until the first week of May.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: toniee on Mar 23, 2015, 03:40:57 AM
Thank you for all your responses. As someone pointed out, I am not that much of a sexual being, so was just fascinated by this article and what remarks would be thrown up.

As someone who is trying to establish themselves as a writer, I feel I ought to know about the real facts of sexual practices  that, as lesbians etc, we are all aware aren't usually expressed realistically throughout society, and the entertainment outlets.

Having read up on 'Fifty Shades of Grey' and how the 'woman' writer has written a story where stalking, violent practices and safe words being ignored in sexual contact, I really think that this particular writer, and that of the film version, and others, mostly males, who express these myths about women's sexualities, should be asking for such relevant advice themselves, so that impressionable types won't be influenced by their suggestive material that objectifies women and doesn't allow for their  sexual needs to be expressed in mainstream films etc.

There's a film out called 'Appropriate Behaviour' which appears to be a more realistic take on such relationships. Oh that I could write in such a sophisticated manner... But, yes, it has helped to clarify my mind on this topic, these comments by actual experienced lovers.  Maybe someone should suggest that school curriculums should be discussing these type of issues, because from what I have heard goes on in young people's sex lives, there is a lack of focus out there for them, leading to extremely damaging encounters for quite a few of them... Thanks for your honest replies...
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Blythe on Mar 23, 2015, 07:25:40 PM
I dread to think how many people are using Fifty Shades of Grey to educate themselves about S E X.

Throw the damn book in the bin!
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Chewwy on Mar 23, 2015, 07:35:09 PM
Wasn't there a beginners guide on This Morning with Phillip Schofield, a few weeks back?  No wonder A&E are in crisis.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Blythe on Mar 23, 2015, 08:02:35 PM
I will have to youtube that!


Shudder.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Slantrhyme on Mar 23, 2015, 08:22:23 PM
I wasn't sure if I should laugh or not...  :-\ Sounds cringeworthy in the extreme.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: toniee on Mar 24, 2015, 02:36:31 AM
Perhaps I should track that down too? They do say you can learn just as much by how not to do things, by observing amateurs, as by watching experts!!!
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: toniee on Mar 25, 2015, 02:03:12 AM
Just another thing that sort of had me pondering. Does anyone really indulge in 'fisting?'. It seems one of the most illogical of 'sex acts'. I mean, what possible sexual stimulation, either way, could anyone get, or give, from this? Is it even really possible? Sometimes, it does sort of amaze me what some people will do to get 'sexual kicks' by what might be seen by most people as 'extreme practices'.

As already explained, I am not really that motivated by the sexual act alone, so it does bemuse and befog me how and why people need to 'stretch the boundaries' so to speak, of what most people would consider going beyond the pale. With that act particularly, well, I just don't 'get it'. Can anyone shed any light on this(s'cuse my ignorance, but even if I were sexually active, that sort of 'fringe element' to sex would hold no appeal to me. Just a personal take on the topic of sexual matters..
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Meryl Streep Fan Club on Mar 25, 2015, 07:58:40 AM
Just confused as to why this is now in Whatever You Fancy! as opposed to the Vault?

GB is getting weirder and weirder. Must be the X Files effect.......
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Chewwy on Mar 25, 2015, 08:05:59 AM
Just confused as to why this is now in Whatever You Fancy! as opposed to the Vault?

GB is getting weirder and weirder. Must be the X Files effect.......

 :D
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Cas73 on Mar 25, 2015, 08:27:10 AM
Just another thing that sort of had me pondering. Does anyone really indulge in 'fisting?'. It seems one of the most illogical of 'sex acts'. I mean, what possible sexual stimulation, either way, could anyone get, or give, from this? Is it even really possible? Sometimes, it does sort of amaze me what some people will do to get 'sexual kicks' by what might be seen by most people as 'extreme practices'.

As already explained, I am not really that motivated by the sexual act alone, so it does bemuse and befog me how and why people need to 'stretch the boundaries' so to speak, of what most people would consider going beyond the pale. With that act particularly, well, I just don't 'get it'. Can anyone shed any light on this(s'cuse my ignorance, but even if I were sexually active, that sort of 'fringe element' to sex would hold no appeal to me. Just a personal take on the topic of sexual matters..

Bold mine. 

Yes toniee, people do indulge in fisting.  What possible sexual stimulation?  Well erm, think about it  ;)  And yes it is possible, with plenty of trust and lube available.

And extreme is just a matter of perception.

I agree Meryl, this topic definitely needs to be Vaulterised.  Although it is amusing that it's now in the Whatever You Fancy section considering toniee's question ;D

Edited to add a little more.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: dukovearl on Mar 25, 2015, 08:52:55 AM
Evict's choice - the moving location, not the fisting - I don't know if anyone else asked for it to be moved from work safety (I'm boycotting those initials  ;) ) but I did and perhaps she didn't quite picture me in the vault  ;D


As for fisting, well, it's not for those who dislike penetration, but I have it on reasonable authority that the feeling of fullness is amazing and the G-spot gets the attention it craves, plus because it is potentially painful the trust involved is a buzz. I haven't slept with anyone who enjoyed pain, so I can't comment on that possibility.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: flora poste on Mar 25, 2015, 09:52:33 AM
Just another thing that sort of had me pondering. Does anyone really indulge in 'fisting?'. It seems one of the most illogical of 'sex acts'. I mean, what possible sexual stimulation, either way, could anyone get, or give, from this? Is it even really possible? Sometimes, it does sort of amaze me what some people will do to get 'sexual kicks' by what might be seen by most people as 'extreme practices'.

As already explained, I am not really that motivated by the sexual act alone, so it does bemuse and befog me how and why people need to 'stretch the boundaries' so to speak, of what most people would consider going beyond the pale. With that act particularly, well, I just don't 'get it'. Can anyone shed any light on this(s'cuse my ignorance, but even if I were sexually active, that sort of 'fringe element' to sex would hold no appeal to me. Just a personal take on the topic of sexual matters..

ooooohkay. Finding your 'fringe element' 'sex act' quotation marks and tone a wee bit judgey.

I know you have confessed your ignorance and that you are truly interested in learning - I know also that you don't get why people might do this stuff. But just because it's your cup of tea doesn't mean it can't respectfully be other people's.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: fetishkitty on Mar 25, 2015, 09:55:51 AM
God, I love fisting, both giving and receiving. I had a partner last year who could be double fisted...in two permutations (I'll leave it to your imaginations as to which two). Incredible.

Sorry, am I lowering the tone?

And yeah...judging other people's consensual sexual activities is impolite.

kitty
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Arig on Mar 25, 2015, 10:25:44 AM
From personal experience, as someone who doesn't actually engage in penetrative sex often at all, but for my lovers, it is a whole other ball game.
I don't really ponder on why I can find so many sexual partners that crave what I want to give, but not receive. Why would I ponder about it?

So does anyone engage in it? Too many people to count. Both ways and also there are people into double fisting.

Illogical sex act? What are the logical ones and what is your comparison too? For me, illogical would be heterosexual sex depicted in romantic films. Weird looking and holds no appeal to me, do I understand why anyone would want to engage in "that"?? No. But I assume it is because they enjoy it...

People engage in fisting because they love it, want it, crave the feeling of fullness and the sensations that only a full hand inside them can provide. They come and they want more or they don't come but enjoy it to such a crazy amount it is better than coming or having multiple orgasms.

Is it even possible? Yes, VERY. Google and find sex blogs with info, it's widely available. Lube and trust are just the beginning.

I don't know what you mean with extreme, if someone wants to participate in a certain sexual act and finds partners into it all adults, consenting and informed... What is extreme about that? The loving trust they have between them? Is that beyond the pale?

Ignorant or not, giving value judgement on people's possible sexual choices is a fringe behaviour in itself, even though socially speaking it is the done thing, so is being homophobic or sexist but I still do not appreciate reading it here.

There is a difference between asking questions for information on something you do not understand and labelling what you are ignorant of as "fringe" "extreme" "beyond the pale" and say they are "sex acts" that are you wonder as to the extent people will go for "sexual kicks". It is rude and judgmental.
The fact that you yourself admit and explain sex is not a priority to you does not in any way prevent you from being able to ask a question without labelling those who may engage in what you are asking about.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Slantrhyme on Mar 25, 2015, 01:42:08 PM
Fisting, yes, it's perfectly possible, and yes, it can be intensely pleasurable, but as other people have said, it takes a lot of lube, and trust, on both sides.
Also, as other people have said, I don't want to see sex shaming on here. We've got the heterosexual world for that. By all means ask questions, but don't weight them with such judgmental opinions, especially when you have absolutely no experience in the matter.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: toniee on Mar 25, 2015, 01:42:25 PM
Apologies if I have offended anyone here. Wasn't my intention. And yeah, perhaps I have been too 'judgmental'. I guess, as someone who has never engaged in penetrative sex, the very thought of 'fisting', and any pleasure it may give to a lover, seems rather a forbidden thought to me- simply blows my mind at such a suggestion.

I have 'confessed' that I am an ingenue on these topics, and really this doesn't get discussed much in mainstream entertainment or publications or lesbian ones either, so it is something that I haven't really been exposed to - this idea- that women not only indulge in such activities but get a sexual buzz from it?? It still leaves me with a bit of a shudder down my spine, I confess, that actual thought.

I also accept the label that someone gave me of being 'rude' and 'judgemental' on this particular subject and again apologise. I've really lead an incredibly sheltered life, coming from that awful background of mine and the extremely unfortunate circumstances of my life that has really prevented me from participating in the wider lesbian community, so I guess that, in a strange way, my curiosity level is that connected to a teenage school kid's one. The fact that I only had one and a half years at secondary school and missed out on sex education there and at home, just really compounded my ignorance in such matters.

I am open to opposite points of views and apologise that I expressed myself so clumsily on this matter. It does intrigue me that such things are not only possible but pleasurable? The sort of creative thinking in my head now of the parallel existence that could have been mine if things had been different for me and I had been allowed to experience such delights with women.

I have been informed that it is best to transfer this subject to The Vault. This being considered a 'hot potato' of a subject. I hope I haven't offended anyone with my queries etc. It wasn't my intention. Just reflecting on the sort of things that lesbians etc get up up to in their sex lives.

I like to believe I have a 'healthy fantasy life'. I just wanted to hear what other experienced women find sexually stimulating, given that this topic, on what really turns on lesbians etc is not something you normally come across in everyday discussions etc. Someone did suggest seeking out such things online for enlightenment, but I am not sure I would be able to 'tolerate' such explicit stuff being shown or talked about directly...? Thanks for all your input and updates on all this. Very informative...
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: fetishkitty on Mar 25, 2015, 01:57:02 PM
Thank you for the apology :)

I would also say that just because other people enjoy penetrative sex, fisting, oral sex, anal sex etc etc, it doesn't mean that you have to. You don't even have to 'try' things to decide that they are not for you. Nobody should ever make you feel bad for your sexuality (I mean that word in its broadest sense). You have full autonomy over your sexual self. Anyone who tries to change that without your consent is a wrong 'un.

So, if you don't want to explore these things, online or otherwise, then don't. They are not 'required behaviour' in any sense. Sex should always feel good. It's not a competition or some kind of 'self-improvement project', unless you want it to be. There are plenty of women who don't like penetration or any other sexual activity...it doesn't make them bad people or 'not real' lesbians.

kitty
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Musette on Mar 25, 2015, 05:39:16 PM
^ exactly this.

Also, toniee, it might be hard for you to believe, but if there is a sex act you can imagine or have heard about, then you can bet that someone, somewhere, is doing it. For fun :)
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Slantrhyme on Mar 25, 2015, 07:38:14 PM
And a lot more besides. People get up to all sorts of Wierd and wonderful things in the name of pleasure. As long as it's between two consenting adults then go them.   
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: millicent on Mar 25, 2015, 07:45:37 PM
In summary, it's a beautiful time to be alive.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: toniee on Mar 26, 2015, 03:01:57 AM
Really I am just pleased we live in relatively 'enlightened' times where such thoughts, feelings, actions can take place for women who choose to do so. And the fact that modern technology allows contact with other women who, although may not share my own personal tastes on certain subjects, allow me insight in other possibilities for those who wish to indulge in such things. All in all, I guess it is a splendid era to be living in.

 The fact that, although I might hazard the guess that most gays and lesbians might cover up their sexualities, in their private moments they can do what they what they want as long as , as someone correctly pointed out, they are all consenting adults. Something of which I have always believed in, but unfortunately, it seems to me, that in mainstream society, that isn't always the case.

 Perhaps that is why lesbianism is seen as so much of a threat to it. The idea, maybe, that for the majority of them, perhaps their relationships are more healthier than most, from what I have observed all around me here and in life, not to mention some of the 'crazy' images and 'storylines' that go for the interpretation of women's sexualities(I site 'Fifty Shades of Grey' and that type of misinformed dangerous nonsense that distorts the reality of violence on women etc that, it seems to me, in this culture and others, seem to 'glorify' such atrocities.

 I hope people don't think I am speaking out of ignorance, but what I see in life and films etc really disturbs me sometimes, the sheer madness of what is being portrayed there at times. No wonder they want to subjugate and belittle women's empowerment as sexual beings, and their right to make their own choices in these matters. I think it was 'The Beauty Myth' book that suggested something like, 'women's sexualities have to be curbed by patriarchy because it has the potential to threaten 'civilisation' as it currently stands. Quite an empowering thought, I felt on reading that..
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: mint on Mar 26, 2015, 10:42:43 AM
To be honest I read that recently and I think she's somewhat hypocritical as she appears to have her own agenda in terms of policing women's sexuality anyway.

As someone wiser than me said: Sexuality is not the problem, the sexualisation of women in media is the problem.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Musette on Mar 26, 2015, 12:12:43 PM
I think men fear women's sexuality.
I think they fear and despise lesbians because they don't even look to men to satisfy that sexuality.
I think men think that everyone should be in awe of the mighty (bio) cock.
They are confused, therefore fearful, therefore angry, when that isn't the case.

Slight wander off topic, but hey ho.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Slantrhyme on Mar 26, 2015, 12:44:51 PM
I just think men fear women full stop. They've so carefully built up this fragile myth about masculinity and how to be a manly man, that anything that contradicts that, or is beyond their control scares the bejesus out of them. Better not to let it get out of control, and that which is already out of their control has to be mocked and derided, attack being the best form of defence and that.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Musette on Mar 26, 2015, 11:13:51 PM
Yup, that too.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: toniee on Mar 29, 2015, 12:40:19 AM
It was VIrginia Woolf who said that no one could fail to notice that we are living in a world controlled by patriarchs. It still amazes me how many women, of whatever persuasion, still refuse to accept the obvious, one being a correspondent of mine who backed away from this when I contradicted 'her version' of reality, basically what she had been instructed to believe in by the dominant male narrative. That always puzzles me. Why women defend the system that evidently oppresses them...

I was thinking, in a way a bit of a disturbing thought, but knowing the way the world is set up, in favour of men, it does puzzle me that they have 'allowed' women and gays/lesbians to have a smidgen of power and autonomy, when really they could have continued to deny us all that? To their own advantage? I wonder why those elites in the past allowed those with little power to change things, some amount of liberation to live lives freer than in the past and allow more choices to be made? That's rather an unnerving thought, considering the way society/the world seems to be going with attempts to control women etc. Quite a worrying aspect going on in this world, methinks..
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Lust for Life on Mar 29, 2015, 11:32:09 AM
If 'fisting' were called 'filling' it wouldn't get so many  :o reactions from the uninititiated.

There are hundreds of variables which affect how much fits when.  The same two people may only sometimes be able to do it, and some partners may never be able to. A major variable is willingness (on both sides). 

And Fetish kitty's post is ace.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: toniee on Mar 30, 2015, 05:39:30 PM
Just a comment. Made to me quite some time ago by what you would call an 'unreliable narrator' who was one of these types who liked to embroider their conversations with 'embellishments', shall we say. It did sound quite preposterous to me at the time, and still does, so I thought I'd put it out there and see what others comments are on this.

This particular female, a bisexual friend of yesteryear, suggested to me once, that she had known a woman who had been traumatised by sexual abuse which consisted of being violated and then 'sewn up', her vagina, and violated again???

The fact that this is a very serious topic, violation, sort of made my eyebrows raise, the possibility she could be making a jest out of such an extremely potentially psychological and physical effect this would have on anyone, but does anyone really believe this as a possible fact? The sheer absurdity seemed to scream out at me and still does?? And, if untrue?, why would anyone make such a crass joke out of such a serious subject? Any suggestions...?
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Groke on Mar 30, 2015, 06:33:13 PM
Why did you think it was a joke?
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Another Dyke :/ on Mar 30, 2015, 06:44:58 PM
I think if sex painful..you simply don't 'want it enough' so : have it when you Do! ;)
Or..maybe you Tired, or..your 'partner' - talk to her, help her..she can't read minds! Sometimes you get 'stuck in a rut' or 'do the things you know !You like/like to receive' - kind information, smiles, focussed UNcriticaltalk 'outside the bedroom, not in the heat of the moment!'
Some girls get it wrong through lack of experience, shown by certain ways they do things..perhaps they think it won't spoil things if they just mirror what they favourite.
But sometimes people 'not in the mood' - perhaps they can only really 'do it' on certain nights/hours (say if they flatmates!) and..
a VERY good idea is to not go to bed with expectations..cuddle a lot, progress from there, be affectionate, have alot of foreplay, kiss alot and..you know, let HER lead it..
Bed is fun, not a Battleground - when it IS, you shouldn't be there..
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: toniee on Mar 31, 2015, 12:03:10 AM
Why did I think it was a joke, that comment that female made? It seemed almost an impossibility? I can imagine that there would be sadistic enough males, and even some women following the dictates of their men, to do the 'sewing up', so to speak? But just how would a man violate a woman who had had this done to her?

 The implication my former friend gave was that this woman had been 'penetrated' by the male organ. Would that have been possible? Surely it would have been considerably painful for the aggressor too? That's what made me question it?

The fact that things like FGM goes on in this world proves, additionally, just how far men, and unfortunately, some women will go to control or prevent women's sexual desires, but just what would have been the reasoning for this act, if it did occur, from the point of view of the violator?
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Groke on Mar 31, 2015, 09:49:40 AM
I think, given your professed lack of experience in these matters, it might be best to come from the position of thinking everything was possible.

Though I confess I've never heard of this practice myself. Although it doesn't sound far off the horror of FGM, which is very real.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Plus One on Mar 31, 2015, 12:08:46 PM
I'm pretty sure I've read about the practice of being sewn up for the sake of the enjoyment of men having a tighter vagina...that seemed to be a bit voluntary and a bit cultural pressure. Can't remember what country. Appalling wherever it was. It certainly wouldn't surprise me if that was being forced on women.

Toniee .... Perhaps your assumptions should be that everything is possible, for enjoyment , for pain, by choice and by force. You seem immersed in finding everything unbelievable, good or bad. It all exists.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Musette on Mar 31, 2015, 12:23:49 PM
Indeed. A few of us have said the same thing now.
If you can imagine it or have heard about it then it's a fair bet that people are doing it, whether you understand it or not.

I've tried plenty of things in my time, but there are still plenty that I've never tried - some I'd like to, some which don't appeal at all. But I know that other people do these things and enjoy them, even if I don't think that I would. Equally I know there are things I do that others would find incomprehensible or implausible (having sex with another woman, for a start ;) )

As long as it's safe, sane and consensual, then anything goes really.
Of course, there are times when things are not SSC, in which case it can tip over into abuse.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Plus One on Mar 31, 2015, 02:22:35 PM
The whole thread seems off to me.

I had decided not to post again but I couldn't let anyone think that the sewing vagina thing was any sort of 'joke' even if I don't trust the motives of thread starter.

 
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Guineapig on Mar 31, 2015, 02:24:59 PM
^ that.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Grey on Mar 31, 2015, 02:38:53 PM
yep

delete and lock?
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: horse on Mar 31, 2015, 06:47:09 PM
I was led to believe everyone on here was a feminist, yet some wander around looking puzzled over the issue of FGM ?
How have you all managed not to have read about this ?

Pharaonic Circumcision (or infibulation),
favoured by the Sudanese I think, same sort of roots as the Jewish practice of symbolically separating the male and female.
The clitoris and labia minora are removed and the labia majora are sewn up until they are married (sometimes it is re-sewn after consummation)
Culturally very hard to break because without this procedure the girl is unable to marry and it is very tied in to how they believe conception works. The western viewpoint of sexual pleasure being the most important thing doesn't have the same weight in these cultures, this is probably why we suck at changing it.

I gather it is also practised by masochists, a variation being the adding of rings to the labia to present a corset image or the male foreskin being sewn up.

Agree, thread needs to be moved.
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: સરસ on Mar 31, 2015, 07:06:30 PM
Nobody here is puzzled by FGM Horse... I can assure you that... What Tonie posted about is NOT about young girls being mutilated for the sake of some god awful barbaric so called cultural tradition..



This particular female, a bisexual friend of yesteryear, suggested to me once, that she had known a woman who had been traumatised by sexual abuse which consisted of being violated and then 'sewn up', her vagina, and violated again???



 ::)

Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Plus One on Mar 31, 2015, 07:14:31 PM
Horse.
What I was talking about did not involve any removal of the clitoris or labia ...it was just about sewing up... even the original poster has heard of FGM (and that's saying something).
But thanks for the lesson.

 




Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: horse on Mar 31, 2015, 07:24:57 PM
Sorry if I misunderstood, entire thread is vaguer than a vague thing :(
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Musette on Apr 01, 2015, 01:53:35 AM
I was led to believe everyone on here was a feminist, yet some wander around looking puzzled over the issue of FGM ?
How have you all managed not to have read about this ?

Seriously?
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: toniee on Apr 01, 2015, 02:08:16 AM
I've been reading some blogs on Everyday Feminism and thought I'd share some of the notions there. Not sure if this is the right thread for it, so am prepared to start a new discussion. I think on other topics this will be necessary...

It's about BDSM. The idea that even if you are asexual you can still enjoy aspects of it. The imagination being fully developed to expose oneself to the delights of some of the aspects involved. The complexity of sexual attraction/desire - the full spectrum of this being allowed(in consensual relationships). It was suggesting in this blog that BDSM can be a kind of cartharsis, for some, to take back control that was taken away from them by abuse. Hadn't thought of that prospect before, why it can be so appealing to some, this attraction to 'kink' as they referred to it. The idea is to create safe, intimate places for women, especially, to empower them to explore their full sexualities rather than the prescribed ones, and to support them in their personal choices.

The idea being that 'painful sex' can be a turn-on to some, whether as receiver or giver, or both. That really fascinates me. The idea that girls are brought up to be demure and coy and allow men to make all the decisions for them and to take control of them sexually. To be indoctrinated into the idea of 'having sex done to you', rather than being a fully sexualised being with one's own needs and desires, still rarely expressed in the West, mostly non-existent elsewhere.

 The idea that some women get pleasure from causing pain during sex, is never really explored in mainstream society. It just sort of suggests to me that the whole idea of the 'sex education curriculum' should be completely overhauled, but obviously this would be far too 'controversial' an idea for conventional society to include.

 That's where I've been most of my life, in traditional land, so please do excuse my ignorance on these topics, but I think you will agree that I am open to debate, whereas most of society, especially males, probably wouldn't want these ideas 'spread' to impressionable, young girls' minds while they are still pliable for change.

 Just imaging if I had been exposed to such things when young, how that would have engaged me and given me a wider choice than the completely restricted, staid environment that I have been in for most of my life. It would really be challenging to the status quo if such ideas were fed to women's minds. Most, certainly the ones where I live, still find it incredible to believe that there is a network of links for lesbians etc to connect up with. We are still really at an embryonic stage when it comes to allowing women the full range of sexual experiences that they might wish to engage in with other women. Mind you, having said that, most of those I have come across in this community don't seem all that imaginative when it comes to such possibilities, perhaps a lack of 'sexual appetite', which again could be due to social conditioning. But, yeah, I can very much visualise the idea of getting pleasure from such activity...
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Cas73 on Apr 01, 2015, 09:36:38 AM
This really needs to be moved to The Vault, or The Dungeon now that toniee has introduced BDSM.

Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Musette on Apr 01, 2015, 10:33:28 AM
^ yes. I just PM'd tonieee about this very topic (and suggested that her new Gender thread go in Identity Matters).
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: toniee on Apr 01, 2015, 11:22:22 AM
Apologies to all. My mistake. As suggested I will be more careful in future where I place my threads. I have messaged the moderator on these two matters, because i don't know how to move threads to one section to another. Hopefully, this will be done now(complete technophobe...). I'll try and get it right next time... Again apologies to anyone who might have been offended by my comments..
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Cas73 on Apr 01, 2015, 11:33:30 AM
I'm not offended by anything toniee, it's just that certain topics need to be in certain areas  :)
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: Musette on Apr 01, 2015, 01:57:53 PM
Indeed - not offended, toniee, just pointing out what's appropriate :)
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: toniee on Apr 01, 2015, 02:16:48 PM
Can anyone tell me how to move these two threads to the appropriate ones? I did contact EVicT, but haven't heard anything back from them. They contacted me early this week about this thread and asked me if I wanted to move it to The Vault, and I agreed, but haven't any other response from them.

I mentioned the other thread today as well, but so far, nothing. What do I do? Is there anyone who can move these two threads to the required ones on my behalf, just in case they do offend anyone who might stumble upon them unknowingly?

I was going to add some comments that I heard Jo Brand, the comedienne, make on the subject of sex, but will wait till these threads are in the right places before I do. They amused me, her jokes, but others might find them a bit 'provocative' as can be the nature of her humour...?! Can anyone assist me with these threads or tell me how to contact someone who can? Thanks.. I'm thinking of some other topics now, on other subjects, so will see if there are any related threads or start my own, hopefully in the right space??!
Title: Re: Painful sex?
Post by: toniee on Apr 02, 2015, 08:16:35 AM
Now this thread has been moved, I will go ahead with Jo Brand's jokes. Just her observations on the subject of sex.

She was talking about sex with men, but obviously this applies to all types. The idea that there is 'a lot of grunting and farting and then they turn round and ask how was it for you!?!'. That got a big laugh from her audience!

Also, she was relating a passage from the book 'written'(probably ghosted one imagines!?)by the army officer, Hewitt, who she was having an affair with Princess Diana(and so many rumours about Harry, nudge, nudge!?). The part in the book where he has just 'made love' to Princess Diana. The prose goes on in its Mills and Boon way, that he looked around at Diana and saw she was crying(obviously intended to suggest that his 'sexual prowess' had brought her to an estatic joy!). Jo hit the nail on the head when she said, in her deadpan manner, 'Don't worry, Diana. We've all had that experience!!!' Which sort of took the wind out of Hewitt's attempt to suggest he was some sort of 'hot lover!!!'. Quite funny that!!

It was even more funny when Jo suggested that because of her 'anti-male' jokes(more like redressing the balance, boys!), and the way she looked, that most people assumed she was a lesbian. She said she wasn't, and that she had received quite a few letters from lesbians telling her, that if she was one, to keep in the closet because she was 'giving lesbians a bad name!!'.

I found that quite believable, recalling a wacky gay publication that was on the scene a long time ago, who had a page dedicated to those stars who were presumed Gay, who they would prefer stayed in the closet too!! It's good when a community can take the 'p--s' out of itself, without being nasty!

As someone said about a very serious matter, I won't go into details, 'you'd think she'd have more of a sense of humour about things!'. Dark humour can be very dark at times. As Voltaire wrote about the great tragedies of this world, what else can you do, but make dark humour out of them? Such is the complex world that we all have to negotiate, every day, to try and maintain some sort of sanity, faced with the absurdity of life all around us. Blind me, alarmingly awake....